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Sean 
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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 Posted - 06/28/2007 : 06:49:19
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quote:
Originally posted by lemmycaution
De gustibus no est disputandum. 
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BaftaBaby 
"Always entranced by cinema."
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 08:17:09
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Chapter One
Okay, there's only one way to settle this: I am always right. If you agree with me, you are right, too. If you don't, you are wrong. 
Chapter Two
None of the discussion - save some of Joe's sentences - deals with Artistic Criticism, a very rigorous discipline indeed. Rather, it's about the realm of opinion; in that realm everyone is right and everyone who holds a different view is wrong. Or, more accurately, they disagree, and no one is right or wrong. Either relatively or absolutely. Because - a priori - opinions are not de facto.
The art or discipline of Criticism follows an ancient tradition pre-dating Aristotle. Sadly, most modern professional critics have long abandoned an informed basis for their pronouncements. Read James Agee on film, or even George Bernard Shaw if you want to see the difference. The trend away from providing a knowledgeable understanding of what is being critiqued began around the time of Tom Wolf journalism, and while I like his style immensely, it has over the decades transmuted into the sloppy travesty of journalism we see today. The best of it is witty; the worst is tyrannical and shock jock and often written to accommodate specific editorial policy.
The critics who mis-judged Psycho on its release were letting their personal or editorial prejudices cloud their professional judgment. They were, for that film, bad critics. The film stands on its own. There are specific reasons why any element of it works.
So, confronted by Best or Worst lists of anything, one has a choice: participate or don't. In a social sense, yes, your opinion [especially to you] is just as valid as that of, say, a judge of the Oscars. In a professional sense, your opinion is irrelevant.
It doesn't matter how much money a film takes or how many people go to see it. Technically the film is able to be judged by those who understand the technical elements, measured against a touchstone of what has come to be known as 'the best.' Standards in a professional sense evolve. Your opinion is not part of that evolution.
Aspects such as acting or direction seem to be more subjective, but they're just as measurable. It has nothing to do with what you like or don't like. That's an opinion. Unless it is underpinned with a knowledge of what's involved in the process, it remains an opinion. That's perfectly valid, and long may they wave ... but it has nothing to do with criticism.
[of course, that's only my opinion ]
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Edited by - BaftaBaby on 06/28/2007 08:29:22 |
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Sean
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 10:14:08
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What a festering pile of dogshite!!!
You are wrong!!!
AAARRRRGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!
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randall
"I like to watch."
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 10:26:53
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All you gotta do is insert the unspoken words that precede every single piece of criticism in the universe:
"In my opinion..."
BTW, I haven't seen SPIDEY 3, but I already don't like it. |
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Downtown 
"Welcome back, Billy Buck"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 13:54:47
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| Well all the fun sure got sucked outta this thread... |
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Beanmimo
"August review site"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 14:06:39
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Just like it was sucked out of me when I watched The Piano |
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Downtown
"Welcome back, Billy Buck"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 14:25:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Beanmimo
Just like it was sucked out of me when I watched The Piano
Totally overrated. |
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Shiv 
"What a Wonderful World"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 14:33:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Se�n
Jaws: The Revenge
I watched this on fast forward, pausing only intermittently just to make sure the characters weren't saying something interesting in the conversation scenes. By the way, I only rented it because of the 'jumping the shark' jokes. Yey, yeah, this movie sure jumps the shark |
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Downtown
"Welcome back, Billy Buck"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 15:13:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Shiv
quote:
Originally posted by Se�n
Jaws: The Revenge
I watched this on fast forward, pausing only intermittently just to make sure the characters weren't saying something interesting in the conversation scenes. By the way, I only rented it because of the 'jumping the shark' jokes. Yey, yeah, this movie sure jumps the shark
"Let's make a sequel to a hugely successful film, and make sure we do everything exactly the OPPOSITE of how they did in the original." |
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MisterBadIdea
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 15:17:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Se�n
quote:
Originally posted by MisterBadIdea
And be damned if I'm going to take away my right to call a movie a piece of shit, it's simply more fun my way anyway.
OK, I'll try another way to assess a movie:-
Spiderman 3 was boring as hell, a waste of $7, an insult to Spiderman, and was skin-deep puerile garbage aimed at morons.
That's the spirit. |
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ragingfluff
"Currently lost in Canada"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 16:44:26
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Seeing as i started this thread, I feel compelled to weigh in on this
"I'm right and you're wrong" nonsense. For the record, my list of "worst" films is not simply a collection of films that I dislike because they were popular. It's a list of films that I genuinely did not enjoy. Only two are in my opinion "over-rated", not by the cinema-going public but by critics and film historians: they are THE SHINING and THE GODFATHER. Many of the other films were panned by critics and in no way can be said to have influenced cinema as an art form. TITANIC will probably be looked at as a film which transformed the way films were marketed, and it accelerated a lot of technical innovations... but my opinion is that the film is poor on every level: the story is weak (how can you call a film TITANIC and not tell that story but choose some pseudo Harlequin romance instead.
In fact, I've read harlequin romances that are better written. I don't care that it won Best Picture and a slew of Oscars. It wasn't even nominated for Best Screenplay. The acting was poor, the direction pedestrian. The only character who really elicited my sympathy was the engineer played by Victor Garber.
if you disagree with this, that's fine. I won't hate you. I just wanted a fourum with lists of bad movies....
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TitanPa 
"Here four more"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 20:25:29
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Ahem....THis shouldnt be a you and me arguement. Just because you hate something and the other person loves it doesnt make it over rated. IT cant be over rated or under rated unless there is lots more people rating it. IF 3/4 of the Earths population love Spider-Man 3 and 1/4 hated it. Then one can actually say that the 1/4 believe that the movie is over rated because they actually hated the film. But if it's an arguement of you and me. How can one say its over rated. You need a bigger rating to have it over rated. ITs someones opinion...not a rating.
anyways. here is my list of POPULAR movies that I hate
BrokeBack Mountain
The Shining
The Truth about Cats and Dogs
The Piano
Interview with a Vampire
DareDevil
Best Little Whore House in Texas
Exorcist
Frago
Matrix
Sense and Sensability
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Chris C
"Four words, never backwards."
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 22:08:32
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My personal shitty movie list includes the following:
Titanic
Pearl Harbor
Being There
Fantastic Four
More when I think of them.
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Shiv
"What a Wonderful World"
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 23:20:18
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quote:
Originally posted by TitanPa
Exorcist
This is a film that I believe truly captured the book. The only scene from the book not in the film is when Blair comes down the stairs bent backwards like a crab - SF techniques were not advanced enough to accommodate this. I read the book first, and was not disappointed by the film. It scared the bejeesus out of me when I first saw it - although I agree that on repeated viewings it can lose its edge.
However, to suppport TitanPa's opinion - I went to see a late night viewing in a London cinema with a friend who had not seen it before - and he fell asleep less than half way through! He claims he wasn't tired, but thought he'd better sleep so he was awake for the movie coming on afterwards!
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thefoxboy
"Four your eyes only."
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Posted - 06/28/2007 : 23:56:05
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I watched a movie after many years that it had been out and only heard goods things about it. It sucked big time and wasted 104 mins of my life.
Adventures Of Priscilla, Queen Of The Desert. |
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WORST FILMS EVER
